Made the journey to Coeur d'Alene two Friday's ago to join Scott in breaking in his recently arrived Star Wars: Battle of Hoth Commands & Colors game. After going over the rules and becoming familiar with the units and terrain pieces, we dug into the game on a mission to work through the first few scenarios.
My initial impression is that play offers a quick, small-sized tabletop miniatures battles with a Stars Wars cinematic theme and a Commands & Colors feel. Rules are not the same as in CC Ancients, but Hoth's Commands & Colors heritage is certainly present. With only a handful of units per side in the opening scenarios, setup is quick. Games are finished almost as quickly. Our battles were often fought to conclusion in under 30 minutes. Several were over in about 20 minutes.
While this was only a first introduction to the game, initial impression suggests the system may favor the Imperial Forces. Imperial infantry can take four hits to the Rebels' three hits and, in our games, the most powerful cards tended to show up in the Imperial player's hand. Unlike CC Ancients, there is no Battle Back process. Players attack with impunity so no counterattack possible. These initial games did not seem to reproduce the same tactical challenges and decision making present in CC Ancients but, perhaps tactics will evolve with more games under our belts?
In the end, it was a very fun day out and I learned a new game system. Looking forward to more trials with Hoth. Did I mention Scott sprung for lunch out too? Excellent!
This Friday just passed, I hosted a four-player replay of the Zallaqah battle. Four different players participated in this contest with three "old hands" and a new player. The game was a real nailbiter right down to the last die roll. Who came out victorious? That is a tale for another time.
I get a chance to try my hand in this scenario in a one-to-one game on Monday.
That's something a little different for you guys Jon. The games seem a bit too short to me? We're you playing simple introductory scenarios designed to get new players used to the rules?
ReplyDeleteQuite different yet still familiar from the often played CC stable of games. The games were very fast, and we worked through the first four scenarios. I am sure these are the introductory scenarios with limited pieces and unit types. Quick games gave us opportunities to try different strategies and tactics.
DeleteI’m a big fan of the C&C concept: fast, fun easy to get into tabletop miniatures gaming. So great for driving new blood into our hobby!
ReplyDeleteMy only challenge with it is the ‘3 areas / with certain cards only being played in a certain area’ mechanic is a bit ‘gamey’ and limits player strategy in a way that feels artificial to me.
In my ‘home brew’ version of C&C I tweaked that rule and replaced thise cards with cards that activate units in a radius around commanders.
This keeps the basic flow of the game, but requires players to use commander units to organize and sustain the momentum of attacks.
It also allows a subtle element of ‘command control’ by rewarding good planning and better quality subcommanders who have larger command radius.
I agree that the CC series are a great entry into the hobby. I have introduced a number of gamers to wargaming through CC.
DeleteI vaguely recall playing your CCA adaptation at Scott's years ago. The design of having three areas with specific cards I find no problem. To me, the game does a decent job of introducing friction through these limitations as well as requiring advance planning through hand management.
I know others have introduced new versions which build upon the core game engine but eliminate both cards and zones.
With such adaptability, CC shows that is a good design at its core.
Absolutely! Great, robust system.
DeleteI like to tweak it to a slightly more complex (but still playable) for me.
Wargamers are rules’ tinkerers by nature, I think.
DeleteGlenn's idea seems good, and gives commanders a bit more purpose in the game, perhaps...I may give it a go!
DeleteGive it a go!
DeleteIf the heritage is Memoir 44 you will find it disappointingly simple compared to CnC Ancients or Napoleonics. Memoir 44 is quite crude in comparison IMHO.
ReplyDeleteNeil
That was exactly along the lines of our discussion as well.
DeleteThe good news is that the system allows more serious gamers to tweak the rules slightly to our tastes.
DeleteExactly right, Anon.
DeleteI quite agree. I retrofitted a lot of CnC concepts to Memoir 44 and it improved the game a lot. One of the very first was Battle Back. Really M44 needs a complete rewrite, but I don't imagine that is going to happen anytime soon.
DeleteThanks, Martin. Why Hoth reverted to a M44 style design when the later versions provided such enjoyable games? It must be a design decision to strip the system back for ease of play.
DeleteStrangely I have just been watching stars wars films. Somehow though were I to game it I think I would need something a bit more visually pleasing ?
ReplyDeleteYeah, the larger figures offered by Star Wars Legion have a more visual presentation to me. That is, until Scott paints his figures!
DeleteThat is pretty doggone cool, Jonathan, thanks for sharing!
ReplyDeleteV/R,
Jack
You’re welcome!
DeleteI did wonder if being based on Memoir '44 whether the rules might be a bit simpler, and the games shorter. Not that I have played it, but the reviews I have read on Memoir '44 make it sound like C&C "light". C&C has about the right depth and pacing for me.
ReplyDeleteHoth is definitely CC-Lite! I love CCA.
DeleteInteresting looking game, never tried any of the C&C games
ReplyDeleteYou ought to give CC a try.
DeleteBattle on Hoth is my son a favourite moment in all SW saga. We have also that tabletop game in polish and We order for Christmas ;)
ReplyDeleteReport back once you have played it.
DeleteThe Star Wars game looks like fun. And I am a sucker for any AT-AT 😁
ReplyDeleteI guess the designers would use a simpler version of CC for a game marketed more widely than the usual wargame. Although, if I remember me when I was under 12, I would have just played with the figures rather than bothered with the game and its rules 😂
PS... the blog title is great!
DeleteThe game was fun and we managed to get in eight games in about four hours including time out for lunch. The rules are likely kept simple to draw in the younger Star Wars fans. At twelve, I would have played the game “as is” and been thrilled. Happy to see you approve of the post title!
DeleteLooks a fun quick game Jon, the figures look pretty decent and when painted should look great and add to the whole experience. Must admit C&C does interest me a fair bit, not a system I have used but plenty do and they always seem give good games, bit more investigation methinks!
ReplyDeleteWhen Scott paints the figures, they will look terrific. If you are in search of a recommendation as an entry into C&C, I think Ancients is the best of the lot. Samurai Battles would be my second choice since it adds a lot of chrome and some really interesting game play and decision making. Always a good game and they play quickly enough to get more than one game in a single session.
DeleteLooked like an entertaining time. I've only solo played M44 and found that it wasn't for me. I've never played CC, so can't compare.
ReplyDeleteThe game does not matter so much when spending time with friends.
DeleteVery true.
DeleteNow it’s your turn on punning post titles! Nice one.
ReplyDeleteChris/Nundanket
Over to you!
DeleteThis will be right up Steve and Dan's street. I'll pass on the info.
ReplyDeleteYes, pass it on!
DeleteThat's a nifty looking Star Wars game, and the Zallaquah game as well.
ReplyDeleteThanks!
DeleteC&C / Memoir 44 seem to be endlessly adaptable! I can understand why they might keep it quite simple for the Star Wars game, probably likely to have a younger audience (though of course Star Wars is almost 50 years old now!). I am due to play C&C Ancients later this week, and looking forward to it..
ReplyDeleteThat game Friday was quite something, I recognise the moment from your picture. Thanks for a grrat game, and I look forward to your report!
“Quite something” in a good way, I hope! I thought the game fun with a lot of interesting play and a lot of back and forth as the two armies tried to get an advantage.
DeleteKeeping the Hoth game simple was probably a design choice since the box shows “Ages 8+”.
Nice mix of games on show, variety is clearly the spice of wargaming life for you too!
ReplyDeleteBest Iain
Variety keeps wargaming from becoming stale, doesn't it?
DeleteVery good on the title Jon:)! Not my sort of game at all, nor 'period', but obviously the whole Star Wars franchise is massive, so what do I know;)?
ReplyDeleteThanks! I know that this is not a genre for everyone, but I would play anything that Scott brings to the table. Besides, I have a small collection of Star Wars Legion that I am wanting to bring to the table.
Delete